Scoring at will: LeBron vs. Melo

No one will disagree that LeBron James is a better player than Carmelo Anthony. However, people certainly seem to think Carmelo Anthony is at least in the mix for top small forward in the league. In fact just two seasons ago when LeBron James took home the MVP award and was named to the All-NBA first team Carmelo Anthony finished sixth in MVP voting and was placed on the All-NBA second team.

Every time we compare Melo to LeBron, Melo pretty much comes up short on every count. The only place Melo comes out ahead is in offensive rebounds per game. While these are valuable they don’t come close to making up for the rest of the game differences between the players.

The one area that Melo seems to get a lot of credit is scoring. He’s called a “pure scorer” that can “score at will” and is “the best offensive player in the game”. It’s very odd for all of this praise to get heaped on Melo when his shooting numbers are not anywhere near LeBron’s. However, the Basketball Reference Play Index Plus gives us an ability to check out what people are talking about. Let’s look at LeBron vs. Melo in regards to shooting when we take location into account. I’ll be using 2010 as that is the season where LeBron and Melo were arguably most similar in regards to popular perception.

Shooting Comparison: LeBron vs. Melo 2009-2010
Distance from Hoop LeBron Attempts LeBron Shot % Melo Attempts Melo Shot %
 Free Throw 773 76.7% 612 83.0%
 At Rim 596 73.8% 593 59.2%
 3 to 9 feet 151 46.4% 155 32.9%
 10-15 feet 101 34.7% 213 44.6%
 16-3pt line 454 39.6% 473 40.2%
 Behind 3pt 437 34.1% 206 31.6%

When we try and see where Melo outshines LeBron as a scorer we get our answer. From 10 feet to the three point line (midrange jumpers) Melo is a much better shooter. However, from close to the hoop and beyond the arc LeBron is superior. In regards to almost all of their shots they are very close in attempts with one exception. Melo likes taking more shots in the 10 foot to the three point line range. Neither LeBron or Melo is good from this range (Ty at Courtside Analyst has a less than favorable term for these shots). LeBron’s strength comes from the fact that he is very good at easy shots and he takes a lot of them. When given the option of taking a midrange jumper or getting behind the arc, LeBron is much more likely to get behind the arc than Melo. LeBron also gets to the line more often.

All of this boils down to shot selection. LeBron James is better at easier shots and as a result he takes fewer of the hard shots. Melo is better at some of the more difficult shots and is prone to take them. The issue is that the scoreboard doesn’t care! Did LeBron get his two points for an easy jam or by a pull up jumper? Who cares? In complimenting Melo for being a pure scorer what people need to realize is that shot selection is part of being a scorer! Taking bad shots at a better rate than most players may be impressive. However, the NBA is not a game of HORSE. I will conceed that Melo is better at making worse shots than LeBron is. However, I see nothing pure or impressive about a player that chooses to take bad shots.

-Dre

Fans vs. coaches in picking NBA talent

I recently wrote an article about how the fans made a few mistakes picking their NBA All-Stars. Yesterday, I put up an article pointing out how the coaches made a few mistakes picking the NBA reserves. The point I took with the coaches is that the coaches are supposed to be better judges of talent. A weird thing came up while I was comparing the two articles.

Now I know the criteria for picking All-Star candidates is a bit rough. The filters I used were 20+ games played, 25+ minutes per game and looking at the top WP48 in each category (Guard, Forward, Center) (as of February 10th 2012 via the NBA Geek). How did the fans vs. the coaches do when picking talent?

Guards

I’ll get some flack here. Neither Paul or Wade made my cut for 20 games. Had I used 17 games as the cutoff point (Wade’s number of games) then Paul would be ranked #1 out of guards in the league and Wade would be ranked #13

Verdict: Fans

Despite the fans irrational love of Kobe and their desire to mess with my predetermined cutoffs they did a pretty good job picking guards. Paul and Rose were both top 10 and Wade in spite of a bad start is still top 15. The coaches apparently have no clue which players are good in the backcourt. Ray Allen, Kyle Lowry, Landry Fields and Ricky Rubio were all snubbed in the name of high points per game.

Verdict: Coaches

This was was barely in the coaches favor. They did great picking three players in the top ten. Aldridge, Deng and Bosh are all iffy picks especially given some great play out of Paul Millsap and Ryan Anderson. Johnson and Nowitzki are just plain off. Of course the fans also picked Melo. Anyway small edge to the coaches, who picked 5-8 of their players in the top 20, compared to 2-4 for the fans.

Centers

Verdict: Fans

The fans picked the second best center in terms of per minute play in both conference. Essentially they decided they’d rather see Howard than Chandler and Bynum and DeAndre Jordan. The coaches though, did much worse. Gasol was the third best center available and the fourth best in the West (Gortat would have been a better option). Out east Hibbert in front of Chandler is a travesty. In front of Noah is even more perplexing as they gave Deng a nod. Add in a revived Varejao and an amazing Greg Monroe and the coaches show they have no clue on top centers in the league.

The fans win?

There are a few things to consider. The fans got first pick. We can say “Of course the coaches would have picked LeBron and Paul!” But that’s part of the point. The fans left enough of the best and brightest in the league open for the coaches to pick and the coaches missed on way too many of them. I’m not a fan of the eye test for judging basketball. That said, it’s a bit startling that the eye test seems to be a better judge of NBA talent than the people actually paid to judge NBA talent.

-Dre

 

The NBA’s Latest Revenue Sharing Plan Wouldn’t Have Prevented Carmelo Anthony from Playing in New York

Across the past few months I have written a number of different stories for the Freakonomics.blog.  And over the weekend, I officially became a contributor to the Freakonomics blog (along with such great people as Ian Ayers, Daniel Hamermesh, Justin Wolfers, etc…).

This morning, my first post as a an official contributor went up— Revenue-Sharing Isn’t Needed to Make NBA Small-Market Teams Competitive.  This post examines the NBA’s new revenue sharing plan and argues that this plan will NOT

  • promote competitive balance
  • prevent “star” players – like LeBron James or Chris Paul – from leaving small market teams.

In fact, as I argue, the NBA already had a mechanism in place to prevent LeBron and CP3 from departing small markets (and obviously that mechanism failed).

When fans think about the James and Paul stories, they often turn to the tale of Carmelo Anthony (at least, for the purpose of this post, that is the turn we are taking).

About a year ago, Carmelo Anthony was traded by the Denver Nuggets (a small market team) to the New York Knicks (a large market team).  At the time, most observers believed the Knicks had taken advantage of the Nuggets.  After all, Carmelo Anthony is an NBA star.  Or at least, that was the conventional wisdom.

Now that almost a year has passed, people (other than people in the Wages of Wins Network – who have always questioned Melo’s “star” status) have begun to question Melo’s star power.

For an example, let’s start with Ethan Sherwood Strauss from Hoopspeak.com:

Carmelo Anthony is a starting forward in the All Star game, despite playing for a team that leavens empty promises with broken dreams. Despite how his old team got dramatically better after trading him. Despite how he’s shooting near 40%. And despite those despites, Charles Barkley was shushed on Inside the NBA for naming Josh Smith as a possible alternative to Melo, the mainstay. Apostasy!

 

There has been a bit of revisionist history regarding the Anthony trade, by the way. It is now known as the Great Denver Talent Haul. Way back in 2011, this was not the case. The Knicks had killed the Nuggets by procuring this deal. Denver had sadly been forced to swap “50 cents on the dollar,” thus dooming Colorado’s Pepsi Center to be the NBA’s haunted, vacant, blood-sloshed Stanley Hotel. All role players, no playoffs, makes George Karl a…

 

Well we know it worked out in the exact opposite manner. Now the Knicks look haunted, the Nuggets look liberated, and Mike D’Antoni’s seat is hot enough to curdle a diamond. And yet, there is a hesitancy to radically reassess our valuation system. The new story is about how the sum of Denver’s parts exceeded a single star’s worth. And while there is certainly merit to this trope, why aren’t more people asking whether Carmelo Anthony is even a star? Is it possible that Denver’s as much cured of Melo as they are well-compensated for his absence?

Sherwood Strauss argues there are better forwards than Melo, noting both Josh Smithand Andre Iguodala specifically.  If we focus just on the small forwards (Smith is more of a power forward), we can see that Melo in 2011-12 isn’t nearly as productive as several other players at the small forward position in the Eastern Conference (numbers from NBA Geek as of Friday night’s games):

These are just the top 5 at this position in the Eastern Conference.  If you keep going down the list of small forwards eventually you see:

An average player posts a WP48 of 0.100.  So Melo has actually been below average this season.  Of course, NBA fans may find this very hard to believe. After all, Anthony ranks in the top 10 in scoring.  How can a top 10 scorer be below average?

As Sherwood Strauss notes, Anthony does take a large number of shots.  But he has trouble getting those shots to go in consistently this season.  Consequently, his shooting efficiency is quite low, and therefore, his overall production of wins isn’t very high.

The debate around Anthony actually gets at another debate in the statistical community.  A few days ago, Mike Kurylo made the following observations in the New York Times:

...statistical analysts vary in how they evaluate the game, and are not in agreement on a multitude of issues. Perhaps the most divisive issue is the value of shot creation.

 

…Some statisticians such as ESPN’s John Hollinger think highly of this skill, and the stat he created Player Efficiency Rating (P.E.R.) has the penalty for a missed shot lower than the reward for a made shot. Players that shoot a lot, even at a low efficiency, tend to have a high P.E.R. On the other end of the spectrum is economist turned N.B.A. analyst David Berri, who heavily penalizes a missed shot in his statistical method Wins Produced (W.P.). Players who make shots at a high percentage, even at a low volume, tend to have a high W.P.
Because of a large number of variables in an N.B.A. game, it is difficult proving where across the spectrum the value of shot creation lies. But the Carmelo Anthony trade, or perhaps the result of it, might shed some light on the subject.

 

If you’re reading this, you probably already know that the Knicks traded a handful of assets (most relevant, Danilo Gallinari and Timofey Mozgov) last season for Anthony and some other players. You’re also likely aware of the intense media pressure in favor of the Knicks trading for Anthony at the time. Last February, ESPN’s Stephen A. Smith wrote “the Knicks must go get Carmelo Anthony as soon as possible,” and “Danilo Gallinari is good, with promise, but hardly worth holding on to if it means not getting Anthony’s services.”

 

Smith’s remarks represent those who put a high demand on shot creation. By this standard, Anthony’s value was perceived to be much greater than that of Gallinari due to the former’s ability to take more shots. Comparing the players’ stats at the same stage in their careers, Anthony is able to take nearly 38 percent more shots than Gallinari. On the other hand, Gallinari’s true shooting percentage, a measure of a player’s overall scoring efficiency, is 45 points higher (59.0 percent to 54.5 percent) than Anthony’s. Hence those who put a low premium on scoring volume and higher value on efficiency saw Anthony as overrated.

Nearly a year later, the result of this trade seems to be that higher efficiency is more valuable than higher volume when it comes to scoring. The Denver Nuggets have a robust 14-6 record, while the New York Knicks have a mediocre record of 7-13. Not that the fortunes of these teams are based on the efforts of a single player, but they embody the opposite sides of the volume/efficiency argument.

 

The Denver Nuggets are a team that lacks a high-volume scorer. If we limit our scope to players with 100 or more minutes on the season, no Nugget player averages more 16.5 field goal attempts per 36 minutes. New York has two players who fit this criteria, Anthony and Amar’e Stoudemire. Of the Denver starters, the highest field goal attempts per 36 minutes is Ty Lawson’s 13.1. Meanwhile, the Knicks have four starters averaging more than that number.

While New York has more players who are able to create shots, Denver has more players who are efficient with their shooting. The Knicks have eight players with a true shooting percentage lower than 55.0 percent, while the Nuggets only have three.

 

Despite lacking a player who can create shots for himself at a high level, the Nuggets have the N.B.A.’s best offense, ranked by offensive efficiency. Meanwhile, the Knicks, with multiple high-volume shooters, find themselves with the league’s 24th-best offense. It appears that the ability to score efficiently is more important than the ability to create shots.

 

So does this all mean? For basketball analysts it means the high-volume scorer who lacks the ability to sink shots at a mediocre rate is likely overrated by all but a percentage of statisticians. For the Knicks’ current roster, it means that the team has to work on improving the quality and lowering the frequency of shots among their low-efficiency scorers. For the Knicks’ front office it means that perhaps they should abandon their current method of evaluating players and consult with a statistician before their next franchise-altering trade.

Kurylo’s column highlights the essential argument Wins Produced makes:  Players create value when they get their shots to go in the basket.  Just taking shots – shots that are often just “taken” from their teammates – is not a skill teams should reward.

With respect to Carmelo Anthony, the large-market New York Knicks clearly made this mistake.  And the small-market Denver Nuggets have benefitted from this decision.

What does all this have to do with revenue-sharing (the topic that started this discussion)?  Well, the revenue sharing plan – as noted at Freakonomics – would not have prevented Carmelo Anthony from forcing a trade from Denver to New York.  Of course – as I have noted in the past (and as Andres Alvarez did earlier today) – the Knicks could now only wish there was some mechanism to prevent these kind of decisions.  As it is, it looks like the Knicks are married to Melo.  And that probably means, the Knicks are not going to be part of a championship parade in the near future (unless they go watch the Giants parade).

- DJ

How not to compare players starring Kyrie Irving and LeBron James

Thanks to Patrick (@NBAGeek) spotting this Tweet for Chris Palmer(@ESPNChrisPalmer)

  • Rookie numbers: Kyrie Irving 16.8 ppg, 4.9 apg, 3.2 rpg, 49% FG, 40% 3FG; LeBron 20.9/5.5/5.9, 41% FG, 29% 3FG. Pretty close.

When comparing players people like going to the numbers. The issue is that the numbers when used improperly may not be helpful. Let’s examine the issue above. Luckily a few people responded to the Tweet and I get to use them to help!

Per game is an iffy stat. Turns out players play different minutes per game

Two readers spotted this one immediately Imag Shahmiri(@djsweatydank) observed this

Irving also playing way less minutes than LeBron did his rookie year

Coach Benjamin (@Blizyy) also chimed in with:

LeBron also played about 35 mins. Kyrie only gets 25 a game.

Coach B. actually underestimated both players just a bit. So far Kyrie Irving is getting about 27.9 minutes per game. Compare this with LeBron’s rookie season where he got 39.5 minutes per game! So with 40% more playing time LeBron scored 25% more points and this is somehow similar? When comparing two players using per-game can definitely be iffy if you don’t at least acknowledge a difference in minutes per game and also…

Players play different positions in the NBA

Asad Video (@AsadVIDEO) noticed this:

Why are u comparing a PG to a F ?

This is something odd that a lot of stats don’t like to account for (the Wins Produced formula actually does account for it though by the way) In the NBA players play different positions. This means their stat responsibilities are different. Is the fact that Bron and Irving are “close” in assists per game a good thing? In fact most people notice this immediately. When we note say that Gasol has a better shooting percentage than Kobe Bryant the reason (of course) is that Kobe plays on the perimeter and takes harder shots. Now one may question why the big guy close to the hoop doesn’t shoot more. . . but it’s a valid point. Different positions cover different parts of the floor and are expected to do different things. So that brings us to…

An actual comparison

Now I’ll give you that it’s hard to do a lot in a tweet. 140 characters isn’t a lot. Here’s two things you can do though.

1. Go to the NBA Geek’s Comparion Engine. Type in the two players you want (for the same season only or career currently) get the url and paste it into twitter.

2. Go to Basketball Reference’s Player Comparison Finder. Find the players and seasons you want. Copy and paste the url into twitter.

Both of these let people see a lot of analysis quickly and prevent you from killing your Twitter message trying to cram in all the stats you can.

Both of these do per minute analysis so you’re golden. And  if you’re doing a blog post you can more in depth, which I’ll be doing thanks to the NBA Geek’s comparison engine. (Note I made the table by hand, but  the comparison engine does generate some slick ones automatically)

Rookie Bron vs. Rookie Irving comparison (per 48 minute stats unless noted)
Stat Kyrie Irving* Ave. 2012 PG* LeBron James Ave. 2004 SF
 WP48 0.101 0.099 0.080 0.099
 PTS 28.9 19.4  25.4 19.8
 DRB 4.3 3.9  5.1 5.6
 ORB 1.3 0.9  1.5 2.1
 AST 8.5 8.2  7.1 3.5
 TO 6.0 3.7  4.2 2.8
 BLK 0.9 0.3  0.9 0.8
 STL 1.2 1.9  2.0 1.7
 PF 4.4 3.3  2.3 4.0
 2FG% 52% 46.2%  43.8% 45.9%
 3FG% 40.4% 34.6%  29.0% 35.4%
 FT% 82.0% 81.2%  75.4% 77.3%
 TS% 58.2% 52.5%  48.8% 52.3%
 FGA 22.1 16.5  22.9 16.7
 3FGA 4.8 4.7  3.3 3.7
 FTA 6.2 4.4  7.1 5.1
 MPG 27.9 27.0 39.5 21.0
*Numbers through January 26th 2012

It’s a bit of work but when we break apart Irving and Bron’s rookie games there are some similarites. Basically both players took roughly the same number of shots per minute. And it turns out a 2004 SF was actually expected to shoot about as well as a 2012 PG so that comparison is apt. Except when we notice that factoring it to per-minute instead of per game shows up that Irving is an amazing shooter whereas LeBron was a terrible shooter as a rookie.

The other similar stats? Well LeBron being close in assists actually meant Bron was an amazing passer at the SF position whereas Irving is only average as a PG. Rebounds? Other way around, Irving is a good rebounder as a guard, LeBron was a bad rebounder as a forward.

Finally it’s pretty obvious that their shooting percentages were not similar in the slightest. In fact if Irving were getting the minutes LeBron did as a rookie he’d be outscoring LeBron by around four points a game. In fact the end conclusion from all of this to me is.

  • Irving needs to be more careful with the ball (less fouls and turnovers) and
  • Irving needs to play more
  • And Irving needs to shoot more, especially from 3 (see we encourage it!)

Comparing him to LeBron as a rookie is fun given the liklihood they’ll both have the Rookie of the Year hardware on their mantel and both played for Cleveland. If you’re going to do such comparisons though, please do them right.

-Dre

Is Kyrie Irving a better rookie than Chris Paul or LeBron James?

He’s no Chris Paul

Over at TrueHoop today, Justin Havens asked the following question: Irving better than Paul, LeBron as rookie?

Justin answered his own question by comparing each player’s rookie PER. Among all rookies who played a minimum of 2000 minutes, Irving’s PER is the eighth-best mark in the three-point era. Chris Paul’s rookie PER ranks 6th and LeBron’s 26th; therefore, after 13 games, it looks like rookie Irving is better than rookie James, but not as good as rookie Chris Paul.

The problem with PER is that, while it captures the perception of productivity, it doesn’t actually explain productivity very well. PER is heavily driven by scoring totals and is good for predicting All-Star selections, All-NBA teams, and MVP votes — but not wins. In order to answer the question of who was the better player as a rookie, we should use Wins Produced instead.

Player Age MP PER WP48 Wins*
Chris Paul 20 2808 22.1 0.253 14.8
Kyrie Irving 19 368 21.8 0.123 5.9
LeBron James 19 3122 18.3 0.069 4.5

* Wins for Irving extrapolated for an 82 game season

As we can see, LeBron’s rookie season doesn’t compare to Paul’s and Irving’s, and that is true whether we use PER or Wins Produced. But Paul and Irving’s rookie seasons have very similar PERs and very different WP48s; according to PER, Paul and Irving had similar seasons; according to Wins Produced, Paul was roughly 2.5 times better than average, whereas Irving has only been about 1.2 times better than average. Wins Produced says that Paul’s rookie season was about twice as productive as Irving’s rookie season to date. Does that seem a little far-fetched? Well, let’s ignore Wins Produced for a moment and let the numbers speak for themselves:
Stat*  Chris Paul Kyrie Irving Average* PG
PTS 21.5 30.0 19.5
FGA 16.2 23.3 16.5
FTA 7.9 6.7 4.5
TS% 54.6 57.1 52.9
TRB 6.8 6.0 4.8
STL 3.0 1.4 2.0
TOV 3.1 5.9 3.7
Net Poss 6.7 1.6 3.1
AST 10.4 8.9 8.3
BLK 0.1 1.0 0.3
PF 3.7 4.4 3.3

* Stats are per 48 minutes where applicable; average PG numbers from the 2011-12 season

Irving is certainly scoring well — he’s taking almost seven more field goal attempts and more than two more free throw attempts than the average point guard. Not only that, he’s also making these shots at a very good rate. But another important part of basketball is retaining possession of the ball, and it’s something that Irving has struggled with so far this season. Irving’s net possessions (calculated by adding rebounds and steals and subtracting turnovers) are about half the mark of an average point guard. This is mostly driven by his large number of turnovers. Irving is also below average with respect to steals and fouls.

Chris Paul, on the other hand, was also a good scorer — although not as good as Irving has been so far this season. But Paul’s main strength was his ability to gain possessions; his net possessions were more than double that of an average player and more than four times better than Irving’s have been so far. By giving his team extra possessions, Paul gave his team additional opportunities to score points, and as it turns out, this is very valuable. Paul was also above average in every other statistical category other than blocks and fouls; in particular, he was very good at getting assists and drawing fouls.

That is not to say that Irving is a bad player. Irving looked very productive coming out of College, and as I said before, Irving has been about 1.2 times as productive as an average NBA point guard. Not many rookies perform better than average, so this is a pretty good achievement. As well, young NBA players can improve drastically across their first few years in the league, so Irving could still improve on his production in the near future. But let’s not get out of control and start comparing him to Chris Paul just yet.

- Devin